Agency adaptation, gym-sized markets, and why your best new business channel is obvious

In this episode, I sat down with @Sharon Toerek from Innovative Agency to talk about the real shifts happening in agency business development — and the constant evolution that comes with them. We unpacked why 2025 is the year agencies need to get honest about their positioning, how trust — not information — has become the key currency, and why specialization isn’t just smart, it’s essential for survival.

⏱️ Timestamps

0:00 – Welcome and introduction: why the agency landscape feels confusing in 2025
2:10 – The “trust recession” and why agencies are more anxious than ever
5:00 – Why information is cheap but credibility is expensive
6:30 – Specialization as a core sales lever (not just a niche tactic)
9:45 – The fear that keeps most agencies from focusing
12:00 – What ruins deals when you’re not specialized
13:30 – Why the “show, don’t tell” principle beats overblown ROI claims
15:00 – Thought leadership as a frictionless entry point
17:30 – How to build thought leadership around your ICP (not your ego)
19:00 – Should the founder always be the face of the content?
21:30 – Balancing new client acquisition with organic growth
23:00 – Dan’s “Trust Matrix” for prioritizing outbound calls
24:30 – Systematizing referrals (without being weird about it)
26:00 – The three “food groups” of agency sales
28:00 – Why most agencies over-engineer outbound and underdeliver
29:30 – What’s surprised Dan about agency sales in recent years
31:00 – What smart agency owners are doing differently
32:00 – Where AI helps — and where it’s just shiny object syndrome
34:00 – Why more agencies will start to look like consultancies soon
35:00 – Where to go to learn more about Dan’s model

🔑 What You’ll Learn in This Episode

• Why we’re in a “trust recession” — and how it’s quietly killing cold outreach
• How to develop perspective, not just thought leadership
• Why specialization isn’t optional — it’s how you earn trust
• A practical way to turn your network into a referral engine
• The three-part system Dan recommends for reliable agency growth
• Who should own sales and content when you’re a small agency (and what to do if it’s you)
• Why agencies that ignore perspective end up sounding like everyone else
• The difference between old-school hustle and smart modern outbound